Posts by Nathan Natas

20

Rewriting the dictionary

by rebel8 in

jw
friends

i got a really lengthy pm from a poster i don't know, scolding me for saying there is a difference between rape and religious abuse.

i recently had a conversation with someone who says eating oysters is vegetarian.

when i pointed out it isn't, the person said we all have different definitions of vegetarian.

Nathan Natas

Sure, TotallyADD; a person who has had his arms cut off with a machete is identical to someone who was called "stupid" by their parents. Got it.

20

Rewriting the dictionary

by rebel8 in

jw
friends

i got a really lengthy pm from a poster i don't know, scolding me for saying there is a difference between rape and religious abuse.

i recently had a conversation with someone who says eating oysters is vegetarian.

when i pointed out it isn't, the person said we all have different definitions of vegetarian.

Rebel8, I always enjoy your comments. I think I might know the thread that you're talking about; I started a counter-thread that is now only invisibly present on this board. Well, joke 'em if the can't take a...

Best wishes to you!

39

Free today - the book I wish I'd found when I was getting out of JWs.

by AngusOg in

jw
friends

it's called quitting jehovah's witnesses & other cults: how to do it & why you should, and i hope you'll check it out.

i wrote it because other books seemed to focus on personal experiences (boring, irrelevant) or doctrinal discussion of why i should convert to some other religion (boring, irrelevant and insulting).

anyway, it's an ebook, it's free, and it's out today..

Nathan Natas

Maybe it isn't the meaning of the word "free" that was misunderstood, but the meaning of the word "today."

Angus, I haven't used Kindle previously, but yesterday, while the book was free, I downloaded and installed Kindle for PCs and then "bought" your free book.

Then I stayed up WAY past my usual bedtime and read the whole thing!

Thanks for the gift!

"Quitting Jehovah's Witnesses..." is an EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT book, and will be a valuable psychological stabilizer for anyone who has decided to quit.

I agree with much of what you have to say and at times felt like I was reading my own words. I quit Jehovah's Witnesses in the 1970s - nearly 40 years ago. I was introduced to Jehovah and his motley crue when my mother decided to accept a "free" (all we ask is your brain) home Bible study. I was about 7. I left when I was in my early 20s, having been a pioneer (with a IV-D draft status), an MS, and started to give the one-hour talk on Sunday. (Just once, but it means something to be asked, and many JW men in their 60s have never been asked to do this.)

I disagree with you on a couple of minor points:

You say there are TWO categories of XJW books; personal stories of conversion and books that explore and refute Watchtoer doctrines, usually making a pitch for something else.

I would suggest two additional categories; books that offer a historical view of the evolution of Watchtower doctrines, like "A People For His Name" by Timothy White (the pen-name of Antony Wills); "Apocalypse Delayed" by James Penton; and one of my favorites, "Visions Of Glory" by Barbara G. Harrison. I will admit that Barbara's book is a combination conversion story/history, expertly done.

My fourth category would be ressurrected Watchtower books; books originally printed by the Watchtower years ago that have been made to drink a cup of tanna-leaf tea, coming back to walk the earth like the Golem of Brooklyn, NY, wreaking havoc with Watchtower obfuscation and historical revisionism, proving that the Watchtower fabricates and lies about its history.

This is a minor point, but because I personally have put much work into cat IV books, the distinction matters to me.

Much of what you suggest as helpful de-programming techniques I have also found helpful. Each taboo willingly and thoughtfully practiced proves "for thou shalt surely die" to be an empty threat. Give blood; eat a blood sausage, but don't expect it to be tasty; buy a Ouija board and some Tarot cards, attend an all-night meditation, learn how to kill a man with your bare hands. Have FUN. "Do as thou will is the whole of the law."

On the other hand, "for in that day thou shalt be as God" is pretty much a load of crap too. What we are is naked ape boys, not far removed from the animals we eat and keep as companions. The scene depicted on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel is not a photograph, it is from the imagination of Michelangelo, it is how he wished it was. Look into your dog's eyes and understand that he has feelings just as you do.

Good work, Angus!

8

The faithful and discreet slave's proctologist

by Terry in

we are told we cannot sit down with the bible and discover the "truth" because we need the faithful and discreet slave's channeled knowledge.. so, logically, if we can't get the truth from the bible we are getting it from the slave who isn't getting from the bible.. where is the faithful and discreet slave getting the truth?.

see the topic title for your answer.. yes, the proctologist sees the real channel of communication the watchtower society has!.

they are pulling it of their ass..

Nathan Natas

Terry observed, "So, logically, if we can't get the Truth from the Bible we are getting it from the slave who isn't getting from the Bible."

Right on!

22

YAY!!! My first time being shunned and it was humorous to say the least

by confusedandalone in

a good friend of mine invited me to a party after her meeting on sunday.

i told her i was not going any longer and she doesn't care.

she also let us know that no other witnesses would be there.

Nathan Natas

In such a setting, begin talking to him as though he was in a shunning contest and was not doingg so well. He can't speak to you: those are HIS rules. You can make him look like the fool he is.

"OK, folks, the shunning has begun, and Bob is pretending to not see my outstretched hand! But how long can he maintain the pretense? OH! Bob has turned his back and is walking away! Let's help him, shall we? Gimmee an "S"... S! Gimmee an "H"... H! Gimmee a "U"... U! Gimmee an "N"... N! What's that spell? SHUN! What's that spell? SHUN! What's that spell? SHUN!..."

44

Interesting experience while protesting at district conventions

by theron ware in

for three weekends this summer, a friend and i protested outside district assemblies being held in the tucson convention center.

our approach was very low key and completely non-confrontational: we just held our posters and smiled.

this was our experience at the first two assemblies (for the third assembly, see the next paragraph).

Nathan Natas

I agree with Paralipomenon; choreograph a simple silly series of moves - shift left , shift right, shift in opposite directions, switch sides, have one of you move and the other remain in place, turn it into a waltz - have a third co-conspirator video the scene, then add a music track and make the thing go viral! You will probably have to pixelate the faces of the attendents so that they cannot be identified. If you signs were on extendable poles, like the ones painters use, you can get your signs up above the heads of the attendants. Carry on a one sided conversation with the attendants, "Hey, your tag says attendant, so why aren't you attending?" "What if this was being filmed?" Sing songs from Jesus Christ Superstar just loud enough for the attendants to hear, but no one else.

39

Free today - the book I wish I'd found when I was getting out of JWs.

by AngusOg in

jw
friends

it's called quitting jehovah's witnesses & other cults: how to do it & why you should, and i hope you'll check it out.

i wrote it because other books seemed to focus on personal experiences (boring, irrelevant) or doctrinal discussion of why i should convert to some other religion (boring, irrelevant and insulting).

anyway, it's an ebook, it's free, and it's out today..